tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36762068.post4954235734675052431..comments2023-10-22T05:51:24.101-04:00Comments on Phasing Grace | Social Architectures and Virtual Worlds: Virtual Worlds 2008 Absent InteroperabilityGrace McDunnough™http://www.blogger.com/profile/10573463430195713363noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36762068.post-67082433205153126812010-01-31T20:40:50.733-05:002010-01-31T20:40:50.733-05:00Good call, Grace. There wasn't anything near t...Good call, Grace. There wasn't anything near the hype of October 2007 on interoperability. There was no such secret meeting and hand-holding. That's because there was even more eagerness to have private proprietary worlds, even if more shallow or commercial -- and frankly, that is not the worse thing.<br><br>No users' movement called for interop -- it was a geeky affectation, and seen as such. In fact, some gamers avidly spoke against it. I've come to see it as a bit of a fraud: it's not really about open skies and open standards and universality blah blah blah, and wow, isn't that a cool thing, walking my avatar out of Second Life for a stroll over to WoW (even just to watch, not interrupt the flow). But it's really just a vehicle for large companies to get others to conform to their agenda. <br><br>Those who need interop work it out. The big news at the start of VW08 was the IBM firewall thing -- and that shows you that they get what they want -- the interop dialogue is just a kind of metaphor, or kind of vehicle, for them to do what they want, which is to take over the space.<br><br>I'm not really sure where Christian Renaud stands on this -- whenever I've asked him where this went, all year since October, he's told me about this or that meeting that seemed to be not making some huge progress -- but then, no one expected it would.<br><br>As for the MMI, I forgot to mention on my blog that this seems to me to have forked. On the one hand, Robert Bloomfield is still fooling around with it, but it sounds unformed, not having any huge backing or traction, and the criteria for selection murky. I think the short form is: it's not happening. <br><br>Meanwhile, those who have need for this just go and do it, their way. So Reuben Steiger of MOU got together some of the other games he works with like Gaia and they made a consortium, with help from Forrester, to do metrics for ROI. After all, what is the MMI *for* anyway? It's for advertising and figuring out ROI. So, why not cut to the chase?<br><br>It would be good to have an independent, academic and credible MMI. I personally don't think it would come out of Metanomics, I just think when you have the game companies or computer companies themselves all funding it and guiding it, it's not so independent.<br><br>And yet, to get the job done, the game companies *will* fund it and guide it and then probably charge a fortune to read the resulting reports.<br><br>I also ask, along with Alanagh, whether it's so important for avatars to take their inventory with them everywhere, or whether it's more about identity. <br><br>And obviously I can only feel alarm about a plan to suck all the objects out of SL to make them "portable" by IBM's lights or whomever's lights -- which means they will be under pressure for their "information wanting to be free" i.e. copied. And we'll get all kinds of smarmy little lectures from geeks about how we must embrace the inevitable blah blah.<br><br>Those clamouring so hard for interop will have to be really credible about what they're doing this for -- and why. And so far...they aren't.<br><br>Prokofy NevadyerbrookMEhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17462957723334149373noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36762068.post-74582204260008102512008-04-29T01:39:00.000-04:002008-04-29T01:39:00.000-04:00This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36762068.post-81183103165630228092008-04-15T01:34:00.000-04:002008-04-15T01:34:00.000-04:00Good call, Grace. There wasn't anything near the h...Good call, Grace. There wasn't anything near the hype of October 2007 on interoperability. There was no such secret meeting and hand-holding. That's because there was even more eagerness to have private proprietary worlds, even if more shallow or commercial -- and frankly, that is not the worse thing.<BR/><BR/>No users' movement called for interop -- it was a geeky affectation, and seen as such. In fact, some gamers avidly spoke against it. I've come to see it as a bit of a fraud: it's not really about open skies and open standards and universality blah blah blah, and wow, isn't that a cool thing, walking my avatar out of Second Life for a stroll over to WoW (even just to watch, not interrupt the flow). But it's really just a vehicle for large companies to get others to conform to their agenda. <BR/><BR/>Those who need interop work it out. The big news at the start of VW08 was the IBM firewall thing -- and that shows you that they get what they want -- the interop dialogue is just a kind of metaphor, or kind of vehicle, for them to do what they want, which is to take over the space.<BR/><BR/>I'm not really sure where Christian Renaud stands on this -- whenever I've asked him where this went, all year since October, he's told me about this or that meeting that seemed to be not making some huge progress -- but then, no one expected it would.<BR/><BR/>As for the MMI, I forgot to mention on my blog that this seems to me to have forked. On the one hand, Robert Bloomfield is still fooling around with it, but it sounds unformed, not having any huge backing or traction, and the criteria for selection murky. I think the short form is: it's not happening. <BR/><BR/>Meanwhile, those who have need for this just go and do it, their way. So Reuben Steiger of MOU got together some of the other games he works with like Gaia and they made a consortium, with help from Forrester, to do metrics for ROI. After all, what is the MMI *for* anyway? It's for advertising and figuring out ROI. So, why not cut to the chase?<BR/><BR/>It would be good to have an independent, academic and credible MMI. I personally don't think it would come out of Metanomics, I just think when you have the game companies or computer companies themselves all funding it and guiding it, it's not so independent.<BR/><BR/>And yet, to get the job done, the game companies *will* fund it and guide it and then probably charge a fortune to read the resulting reports.<BR/><BR/>I also ask, along with Alanagh, whether it's so important for avatars to take their inventory with them everywhere, or whether it's more about identity. <BR/><BR/>And obviously I can only feel alarm about a plan to suck all the objects out of SL to make them "portable" by IBM's lights or whomever's lights -- which means they will be under pressure for their "information wanting to be free" i.e. copied. And we'll get all kinds of smarmy little lectures from geeks about how we must embrace the inevitable blah blah.<BR/><BR/>Those clamouring so hard for interop will have to be really credible about what they're doing this for -- and why. And so far...they aren't.<BR/><BR/>Prokofy NevaUnknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17462957723334149373noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36762068.post-80054212883087787942008-04-03T02:45:00.000-04:002008-04-03T02:45:00.000-04:00Thanks a great post, Grace! Maybe the whole dream ...Thanks a great post, Grace! <BR/><BR/>Maybe the whole dream about interoperability is also like that of the tale of Jack and the Beanstalk. After all: "The beanstalk is reminiscent of the ancient Saxon belief in a World tree connecting earth to heaven" (Wikipedia). And for those of us wanting to see the evolution of a broader (technically stronger) platform (with more integration potential) and less silos of corporate market-focused virtual worlds, interoperability is a tall bean stalk connecting us with a 'heaven' of connected virtual realities. <BR/><BR/>Tish Shute writes in UgoTrade: "Toshitaka Jiku, HiPiHi’s new CTO and Executive Vice-President notes: “Virtual goods will be housed in a server for the purpose of creating a market place that will be our vision for an ebay for virtual worlds, so these virtual goods would be portable as opposed to having avatars being portable first.” IBM is also working with Linden Lab in the Architectural Working Group (see earlier post) on scaling and interoperability for Second Life and interoperability and avatar portability is part of the long term vision for HiPiHi".<BR/><BR/>I find it encouraging that portable goods are being envisioned as a starting point, but wonder how important it is to avatars to take a house or clothing between worlds as opposed to taking their names and identities.<BR/><BR/>Well, I hope the 'bean stalk' constructed will be able to take us from where we are, to where we want to be. More importantly, I hope the 'giant' and 'kingdom' we find on the other end will be worth the trip...<BR/><BR/>If not, we still have the 'goose' on the ground with the golden eggs - in the form of Second Life...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36762068.post-24448120740641799182008-04-02T15:42:00.000-04:002008-04-02T15:42:00.000-04:00I think one of the challenges is the the interoper...I think one of the challenges is the the interoperability community has failed to gel in a meaningful way. <BR/><BR/>There is a bunch of work circling around Linden Lab's Architecture Working Group, but that's interoperability in the small, not the large. While there are a number of projects which claim to be focused on interoperability in the large, they aren't anchored in widely deployed systems, which limits one's belief they will have impact. <BR/><BR/>I think that the place to look for some progress in this, is going to be in the Open Source work which sneaks up on interoperability from time to time. <BR/><BR/>I'll be at VW2008, largely at the Enterprise and Open Source sessions. If your looking to talk about interoperability, in the Larger, or Small, I'm all ears.Zha Ewryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09035357429377901332noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-36762068.post-90989903233410646242008-04-01T12:02:00.000-04:002008-04-01T12:02:00.000-04:00> If someone knows where I can find Cinderella, pl...> If someone knows where I can find Cinderella, please let me know.<BR/><BR/>As I understand it, you have to find a glass shoe first ;)<BR/><BR/>Joking aside, great post as usual. Interoperability is just a buzz word at this stage.IYan Writerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00682961187290777139noreply@blogger.com